@elysia crosscode,,,,,,, awawawawaaaa,,, :>

something painful doll r-reealized last night

limbus company probably . genuinely made it less able to- to appreciate library of ruina
and limbus companys story

fuckign gacha bullshit
the . pressure and stress
it just makes it all unpleasant
gah q.q q.q ;;
;w;

@yassie_j doll misread this as kris

kier dreemur is a chode

@raeve @smolcasm

and even the cop-out answers that it hates so much are still complying with that destructive system by letting oneself be trapped within that false choice.

no, the cop-out answers are specifically saying “id just do something else that doesnt kill anyone”, rejecting the choice, and acting like they have the moral high ground for it

…to- to doll, the problem is that people are willing to believe real scenarios are a “one or the other”
if the trolley problem just didnt exist, it… feels like that wouldn’t change anything really?
like, the fact that people talk so goddamn much about it, yeah, maybe that affects it, but…
…idk. could- could just walk up to someone, go “hey, that person over there, they wanna kill you and your friends”, and people’s self-defense instincts will kick in anyways.
not hearing about some random hypothetical isnt the thing thatll change that.
[other things can. just…. not this.]

iit. wuh. >-> ;w;

@V0idT3RR0R > floppy

wait this ssounds like an innuendo doesnt it
fUck
skdjskdjsj . awawa

@V0idT3RR0R awawawawaaa,,,, ehe,,,

unfortunately this doll is not very good at doing anything other than being vanquished,,, it just sort of . gets all floppy . awawaa,,,

@smolcasm @raeve to be honest doll was more focused on being irked at those that rejected it while taking a “holier-than-thou” approach in doing so. [its seen this happen in the past and it was . incredibly insufferable]
like . fucking hell >.>

@smolcasm @raeve yyeah, true

doll jjust gets
,,,triggered ppretty badly by “ah, yes [this extremely simple and small thing] is literally fascism/makes you basically a fascist” type things.
iits. ppain,,,,
aawawa,, ;;; ;w;,,,

@raeve

….refusing to comply, in an actual real scenario, means either fighting back, or sacrificing yourself.
[cuz yknow. the fascists arent exactly gonna let you refuse without retaliation.]
…this, itself, is a form of a trolley problem.

and “refusing to comply [or even considering it] is complying with fascism” is…. kind of an absurd statement.

[also to doll, the point of that variant in the original study is “does it change the result if people are less distant from the killing” (answer: yes, duh)
the- the concept as a whole doesnt feel like its about “minority group”, iits the concept of “sacrifice” as a whole, in the abstract.
…awa >.>]

@raeve …the goal of discussing the scenario is to discuss/analyze a specific concept, going “oh id just do something else” and rejecting the premise is refusing to even discuss the concept
just reminds it of . fascist anti-intellectual bullshit.

,,,going “the scenario is flawed because this almost never actually happens” is fair, and probably true honestly
going “oh well if youre in this scenario just uhhh be Built Different” is fucking lame, and pretends that its impossible to have a situation in real life where at least one person Is going to die
just fucking. denial of how fucked this world is.

it… awa. ;w; ;;;

@raeve nah, it..
..if the question is “what do you do in this fucked scenario”, rejecting the choice is just- fuck, its just rejecting the question as a whole
its- its saying “im going to answer a completely different question and act like its an answer to the first question”

…a- after all, in a real scenario like the trolley problem, theres always the chance that there are no clever alternatives.
theres usually something, but… not always.

…it just feels like “oh, im Morally Good for ignoring this question, and youre Bad for even considering it”, just moral high horse shit
……acts like there arent situations in this world that- that actually are fucked.

@raeve feels like .
the only “wrong” answer to the trolley problem is putting your response up on a pedestal, and treating it as the Right One

[,,,can actually substitute “the only ‘wrong’ way to cope with death”, too
,,,because thats- thats what the trolley problem really is, anyway
,,or at least . the dimension of it that doll focuses on]

@raeve makes sense, awa

this one has seen people going “oh, well id just stop the trolley”/“id just find something that has no people die” in a way that feels like a…. cop-out?
like, they- they don’t wanna acknowledge the actual situation [and/or the depressingness of it?], so they just ignore the whole point of the scenario

…like . i- in an actual situation, yeah, look for another way out, of course
…but a hypothetical situation is one of the only things where it can Actually be only two choices
and doll thinks the only way to handle it is “there is no ‘right’ option, pulling the lever might be less bad, but its still something terrible to be mourned”
and doll feels like most people its seen taking the cop-out dont want to acknowledge this.

@raeve that said, yeah, if youre being given a binary choice youre probably being manipulated, including “this is either solely good or solely bad”
,,,awawa.

@raeve it doesnt measure or judge that either.
after all, anyone fighting fascists [like, with violence] is making the same “sacrifice people to save other people” decision

…what it is, is a case study in why binary/dualistic morality is flawed.

if pulling the lever is good, then that gets used to rope you into fascism. you treat the death of a person, even if its just one, as actively good.
if pulling the lever is bad, then youre unable to handle the situations where it actually is one or the other, e.g. fighting against fascists. [theyre probably very rare in actuality, but theyre… not definitionally impossible.] you treat the death of the many as good.

….so its neither.
its not really either good or bad. or its both.
its…
the kind of thing, where someone, even as they pull the lever, goes “who am i to judge who lives and who dies?
…..but this world is just fucked that way.”
something where… someone desperately looks for any way possible to have no one die, pulls the lever, saves some people, and it haunts them for the rest of their life.

….awawa.

@lizzie ,,oh wait huh
selfcest <–> “self-insert(?) as entities one is attached to”
wait these are probably connected actually
awawaa,,,,

@lizzie selfcest woooooo

@lizzie any time you say wodk doll thinks of the magnetic wodka

@desea wehhhh,,,,