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The Big conversation Why it matters

Looking at our small community we must remember that it is God Who calls and for what we can offer in our community He takes what we have and makes it go further!

Church is the place to bring empty lives for God to fill.
Church is about meeting not just meetings!

In our previous postings we also pointed out that some people may have a wrong opinion about unity and expect all people in a community to say the same and to act the same. But “being one” doesn’t mean “being a clone”. God blesses unity! And we should have and should share our unity in Christ and unity with Christ. All being one in following the teachings of Christ, believing what he says and following up what he asked his followers to do. Not just following a church because it pleases us but because it follows the teachings of the son of God, Jesus Christ, and stays truthful to the Words of God, following God’s Will and willing to share His Gospel. Our union should be in the love for God which should be noticeable for outsiders, being a union of loving people, loving Jehovah God and His son Christ Jesus, Jeshua the Messiah, as lovers of the truth, sharing this love and Good News and spreading unselfish, mutual, unconditional Agape brotherly love and love for all creation under the Covenant of love as beloved disciples and as Bible lovers making a circle of love under the Royal Law of love.

Having different people coming together there should be allowance for every one to have their say. All gathered should have respect for all present and give them the opportunity to share their ideas. Being together it also must be an occasion where public confession, based on a word from God, can take place. This may demand courage to stand up and declare truth, but in a real church of God this should not be a problem because that has to be a place of sharing the love of Christ and working at getting the love of God.

Spending time together to study the Word of God, must do something to those present. Change is inevitable…

except from a vending machine

said Arne Roberts, on October the tenth, at the Big Conversation. For him it is clear what is going to happen to other Bible Students which all came form the same source.

Here’s what will happen to Jehovah’s Witnesses: They will become increasingly like the religious group that influenced Charles Russell: The Christadelphians…
The Christadelphians were once an outspoken, vibrant, edgy “Christian” group who spread their urgent end-times message far and wide. They grew exponentially in the latter half of the nineteenth century, but their heyday is long past. For several decades now they resemble a heavy rusty old steam locomotive that is running out of speed as it lumbers along ill-kept tracks, but still tries to muster the motion needed to take on steep mountain slopes.
The Christadelphians ooze sad irrelevance and faded glory of times well passed. They are an old people’s religion – old people who don’t have the self- and other-awareness to see that they are clinging to a dead dream. The Christadelphians have long since passed their used-by date and the only ones who still ‘practice’ this religion are older individuals who cannot muster the strength to look out their windows at the real world passing them by.
This is the future of Jehovah’s Witnesses, who will not go out with a bang, but who will slowly whimper to an ever slower crawl as the decades pass and the world, in its infinite fascination with religious novelty, will fix its distractable attention on to other more modern belief systems.

For Arne Roberts that is not the end. He asks us to keep in mind that we are fellow citizens with the saints and members of the household of God, built on the foundation of the apostles and prophets, Christ Jesus himself being the cornerstone.

We as followers of Christ should make sure that the Clarion of the Torah may sound. We hearing the sound loudly should make sure that there might be a stimulant for others in our community to become co-workers, helping each other, not working against each other, or not considering each other rivals. As individual beings, planets or stars, we may be totally different, but together we are one part of the universe, just some small elements in the creation of God.

Our very tiny community at a Breaking of Bread gathering at our regular meeting place, the service centre in Heverlee, Leuven.

When people just not come to join others because they are part of a small community than that community shall never have any chance of growing. When people keep waiting before willing to join a small community because it does not attract them for it is so small that they shall be noticed, we do have to convince them that they should not hide themselves behind the numbers. It is true that when there is a small church people will be noticed. In a mega church nobody shall notice it when you come in later, slip out earlier, shall fall asleep or shall not be attentional. When we encounter such doubting people who are afraid to join a small church we can ask them

How long to wait before bringing religiousness and spirituality in practice

It is up to us that God is in our life and that we want to share it with them. They should not be afraid to feel having a naked identity it such a small group, because as followers of Christ Jesus we have abandoned our sinful ‘I’ and actually have taken an other identity, no identity of our own apart from our union with Christ. Not that we have no unique personality or value or purpose, but that Christ defines our new life. It is that inseparable connection within Christ as a believer, which unites us and in the love of Christ we found the love for each other and have to show the world that we want to share that love. When we fail to see our true existence in Christ and fail to find our life and, thus, seek it outside of Christ we shall become victim of our own vain pursuit that only leads to frustration and angst in our God-thirsty soul.

We must understand that whatever happens the majority of people will not want to take the divine Creator as their God and lots of people shall prefer to be part of the contemporary world, belonging to it, being in it, and enjoying a worldly philosophy, inventions of men designed to rob you of your inheritance (Col.2:8-10) and as such shall not be so much attracted to the Christadelphian world, which demands a change in their attitude. The friendship with the world is for most people much more important than the friendship with God loving people. Most shall prefer to stay in the Godless world having not to wonder about their own responsibilities.

It is up to the lovers of God to show the others the light of the world and that no one should worry to much about living in this world. When people could come to know that New world better they might think twice and be prepared easier to leave the Old world for what it is, looking forward to a better and perfect world. We understand it is not easy for man to get away with the worldly traditions, so this shall always be some of the obstacles to join or to stay in our community. But people should not be afraid that they cannot take part in worldly events in a Godless world. Christadelphians for sure also can enjoy worldly life, having enough time fore worldly pleasures, and not to become frustrated under the yoke of the world.

Preceding articles:

Counting sands and stars

The Big conversation

The Big conversation follow up

Reasons why you may not miss the opportunity to go to a Small Church

Additional reading

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Further readings:

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Members of the ecclesia uniting and seeking God’s help in tribulation

Tuesday-night at the meeting of the Ecclesia Brussel–Leuven we read Romans 5 and 1 Corinthians 1+3, looking at the difficulties we have encountered the last few months and how we had to cope with it but also how we should continue our way.
Sometimes we do get to recognise we could not re-conciliate but have to turn over the page and leave those who did not want to be amicably connected with us on their own. Sometimes a community has the priority to protect its own flock and has to take measures which do not seem so pleasant for all people involved. When certain people prefer to stand on their own and are not willing to co-operate the community than has to decide to let them go their own way, but when they themselves did everything to blacken that community, they should not have to keep contact any more. As such we decided to leave the man from the North and his organisation far what they are, and shall concentrate ourselves on bringing people to Christ ourselves, without their help.
Jesus Christ is the man who opened the way to his Father. He is the One Mediator between God and man and is the cornerstone of the Church of God.
We do trust the Most High, Elohim Hashem Jehovah, Who shall call people and Who shall guide us and give us that what we need according to His time.
In Him we trust and give all our hope to build up His Church in Belgium and other parts in the world.
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Related articles
New on the ASOR Blog- Ecclesia Diaboli (I Thought It Was Going to be about the Methodists…) (zwingliusredivivus.wordpress.com)
Alexander Michalak writes: My preliminary examination of several Second Temple texts, 1 Enoch, the Book of Jubilees, Joseph and Aseneth, Testament of Job, the First Epistle to the Corinthians, and the Testaments of the Twelve Patriarchs indicates that there is already at this time a connection between demons and the cult of foreign gods, although they are not always explicitly identified with one another. Sometimes the demonic spirits are said only to lead people astray, that is, to lead people toward Gentile worship and toward idolatry, whereas in other cases it is the demonic spirits who are the objects of worship, or the pagan gods themselves.
The House of Worship (causeitfeelsright.wordpress.com)
The Greek word that should have been translated to church was only used twice in the New Testament. It means “the Lord’s” and was used for the Lord’s day and the Lord’s supper. But this instance is ecclesia. It means “to call forth from out of”. Matthew says if you and the other person can’t work out your problems go get help. Go find a few more people to help because maybe they’ll understand a different perspective. If that doesn’t work go find the ones who have been called out of darkness (1 Peter). When you are in darkness you can’t see clearly and when you are “in the dark” you are ignorant which simply means you don’t know. So someone who has been called out can see clearly, or they are knowledgeable or “in the know” which is having “inside” information.
Mary, Martha & Lazarus – the family in Bethany (hadvarim.wordpress.com)
The gospel narrative then is largely concerned with Christ exposing the apostate Jewish leaders, and building up his apostles as “other husbandmen” to replace them. The parables recorded of the Kingdom of heaven throughout Matthew describe the kingdom of Israel in existence (Mat 11:12), under the governance of the prince of this world – the apostate Jewish leaders (John 12:31, 16:11, Eph 2:2, Luke 10:18, Mat 24:27), and then later to be replaced with the new heavens founded upon Christ as the Abrahamic seed stars are raised to the political heavens (Gen 15:5, Dan 12:2-3, Psa 19:4, 1 Cor 15:40-49, Apoc 4:1).
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A people for his Name
Christ is described as the second Adam as compared to the first Adam (1 Cor 15:45-47). Both of them the “son of God” (Luke 3:38), and both typically created the same way. The body of Christ is the Ecclesia εκκλησια (Eph 5:23, 30, Col 1:18,24), and it is being formed from the Abrahamic dust, the seed of Abraham according to the promises of old; compare Gen 2:7 with Gen 13:16, 28:14.
+The mortal children of Israel are described as Elohim, mighty ones, or as we have in the AV “gods”. Elohim describes the the mental state of the person, not their physical nature. Ambassadors of the father, regardless of whether they are mortal people or immortal angels. If they are empowered by the will of the spirit, they are indeed mighty ones.
When mortal Elohim, mighty ones, do not keep the commandments of Yahweh then they are not immune – by any means – to the consequences of their actions. They will “die like men”.
Therefore we ought to take earnest heed to the things which we have heard. We have all the scriptures… even the testimony of the Son, which brings with it great responsibility (Heb 2:1-3). We comfort in that if we turn from wickedness we will be forgiven. Yet vigilant in the warning that turning to wickedness means rejection (Ezk 33:11-19).
Ecclesia Plantanda (vicaranne.wordpress.com)
Henry Melchior Muhlenberg (1711-1787) … Englishman William Carey … Both men understood that sharing good news need not and must not wait for people to learn the evangelist’s tongue.
church oh church1 (ozyikhiedwardblog.wordpress.com)
why substitute “ecclesia” for “kyriakon”?to support the regular congregating of early Christians,who didn’t understand what Paul and Silas were doing!
What did the New Covenant writers mean when they used the word “Ecclesia” to describe a Christian body of people?? We can safely denote that they intended to convey the original Greek meaning of the word:”A body of Christian called out of Roman and Judean systems of Government,to live under a seperate civil mentality,”a politically autonomous body of Christians,under no other King but Yeshua,under no other civil laws,than that of Yeshua.But some misguided folks misunderstood the missions of Paul, that was why these Christians ran into trouble with kings and rulers,were arrested,crucified,and martyred. They dropped Caesar as their King,and took up Christ. The writers of the New covenant didn’t substitute “kyriakon” with “Ecclesia” to mean entertainment every Sundays,and Tuesdays,and so on!
Apostasy in the Highest Places (mysteryoftheiniquity.com)
The church, the Ecclesia, is a body of people who are redeemed called out to represent GOD and HIS Authority which means they are called to carry our HIS Laws. We are granted the responsibility of not only this but we are accountable for these actions.
The fact that the church is failing man is an undeniable truth but it’s also devastating to the people. How do I mean they are failing the people?
Priority to form a loving brotherhood (christadelphianworld.blogspot.com)
There might be people who do not like that others share the love of Christ with each other and do not mind being under Christ instead of being under one or the other organisation.
Disciple of Christ counting lives and friends dear to them (christadelphianworld.blogspot.com)
Coming together in each-others houses, forming housechurches as a church of disciples they also were an assembly of learners. We too so many years later should be like them a church of Christian disciples and an assembly of persons who believe the things of the Kingdom of God, and of the Name of the lord Jesus, and, thus believing, have been immersed into Christ and patiently continue in the faith and well doing of their vocation, reading, marking, learning and inwardly digesting all things revealed in the scriptures of truth.

Stepping Toes

In the readings of today we look at the brothers and sisters in Corinth some 2000 years ago.

In Belgium the community has been troubled by persons perhaps wanting to claim to have the right to make foundations and to direct the groups of people wanting to come together under the name of Christ.

Paul the Apostle, Russian icon from first quarter of 18th cen. (Photo credit: Wikipedia)

We remember how the apostle Paul makes the argument that he has borne witness to the people of Corinth, he has shared the gospel, he has brought them to Christ and showed them the way but that he has to be sad because he only could see division between those who should be united as brethren and sisters in Christ.

The apostle Paul in his 5th letter to the Romans and his first three letters to the Corinths, also talks…

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