How will AI impact our shared reality? 🤔 Exploring intersubjectivity and the digital future on CTNET. #Philosophy #AI #Intersubjectivity #Tech
#intersubjectivity
@p0kadevil Human #consciousness ("self") exists at the same level as the #ShipOfTheseus and #SantaClaus.
"#Religion is a good example of intersubjective reality: you can't see, touch, or hold it, but the idea exists in many minds across the globe."
#intersubjectivity
«Είναι με τον άνθρωπο όπως και με τα εμπορεύματα. Εφόσον δεν έρχεται στον κόσμο ούτε με έναν καθρέφτη στο χέρι, ούτε ως ένας Φιχτιανός φιλόσοφος, στον οποίο αρκεί το «εγώ είμαι εγώ», ο άνθρωπος πρώτα βλέπει και αναγνωρίζει τον εαυτό του στους άλλους ανθρώπους. Ο Πέτρος δημιουργεί τη δική του ταυτότητα ως ένας άνθρωπος, συγκρίνοντας πρώτα τον εαυτό του με τον Παύλο ως κάποιον του ίδιου είδους. Και έτσι ο Παύλος, ακριβώς όπως στέκεται μέσα στην παυλιανή του προσωπικότητα, γίνεται για τον Πέτρο ο τύπος του γένους homo.»
“It is with man as with commodities. Since he comes into the world neither with a looking glass in his hand, nor as a Fichtean philosopher, to whom ʽI am I’ is sufficient, man first sees and recognises himself in other men. Peter only establishes his own identity as a man by first comparing himself with Paul as being of like kind. And thereby Paul, just as he stands in his Pauline personality, becomes to Peter the type of the genus homo.”
#Μαρξ, Κεφάλαιο, Τόμος Ι, Κεφάλαιο Πρώτο (https://www.marxists.org/archive/marx/works/1867-c1/ch01.htm#19) (1867)
URL: https://rotenotes.wordpress.com/2024/12/10/intersubjectivity-%ce%b4%ce%b9%cf%85%cf%80%ce%bf%ce%ba%ce%b5%ce%b9%ce%bc%ce%b5%ce%bd%ce%b9%ce%ba%cf%8c%cf%84%ce%b7%cf%84%ce%b1/
#intersubjectivity #recognition #αναγνώριση #διυποκειμενικότητα
From Bruce Fink’s Against Understanding vol 2:
In Lacan’s view, no such intersubjectivity is possible because there is always a fundamental hiatus or disjunction—a misunderstanding or missed understanding—between people, because first of all, we tend to misunderstand ourselves (not wanting to know certain things about ourselves), and second, because we misunderstand each other (projecting onto others what we ourselves think, or believe we would feel were we in their shoes, not to mention jumping to conclusions about what they have said
From Bruce Fink’s Against Understanding vol 1:
There is something unknown there, something mysterious, something opaque. This Other knows something about the world that I do not know, this Other has a knowledge of things that I do not have (indeed, this Other might be understood to be the model for what is referred to as the all-knowing or omniscient God in a certain number of religions).
To what extent is intersubjectivity a fantasy? A faith that we can, as bell hooks once put it in a different context, “turn back time and be in that paradise again, in that moment of remembered rapture where I felt loved, where I felt a sense of belonging”? If intersubjectivity is the point at which ‘we’ experience a singular thing, where our understandings are shared, this must be imbued with the impulse of return to the primordial ‘we’.
Even if we recognise our imagined adult intersubjectivity as a precarious achievement, as a process rather than an outcome, the precarity we attribute to it indexes the possibility of a non-precarious intersubjectivity. In recognising how this thing we aspire to must surely be beset by risks on all sides, we dimly recall having once experienced something which did not feel similarly besieged. In doing so we are trying to return to something which never really existed. From Against Understanding vol 2, pg 7:
One of the fundamental facets of neurosis is, I would argue, the ever-repeated attempt to get back to something that is irretrievable. It is irretrievable in large part because we never really had it in the first place, at least not in the way we think we had it: we never really had an exclusive, fusional relationship with our primary caretakers, for example. Nevertheless, looking back on earlier times, we may perhaps believe we did.
I’m wondering increasingly if there’s an echo of this primordial trauma every time we have the impulse to get beyond our misunderstandings. This isn’t to deny the importance of dialogue, understanding and coordinations. It’s rather to dispense with the hope there’s some beyond to these situated and meaningful activities, to begin to shift into the register of symbolic interactionism*, a point at which the fundamental hiatus referred to by Fink disappears into the rear view mirror and you can both breathe a sigh of relief.
It’s a neurotic obsessive fantasy of control that with enough, sufficiently careful, talk the joint in the ‘we’ can be smoothed over and the possibility of rupture foreclosed. The energy consumed by the fantasy could instead be directed towards the understanding which is situationally necessary, as a precarious achievement tied to moving forward, rather than the final overcoming of a possibility which will always be there.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SmrDzlwJPaU
You have buried childish qualities
Friend make sense of me, friend make sense of me
I have many destructive qualities
Friend make sense of me, friend make sense of me
I have so much hurt inside me
Friend make sense of me, friend make sense of me
*Can you read Lacan through symbolic interactionism? This makes me think you can and that it would be immensely productive for my long term project of bringing together Archerian internal conversation and Lacanian psychoanalysis.
https://markcarrigan.net/2024/10/19/there-is-always-a-missed-understanding-between-people/
#bellHooks #BruceFink #fantasy #intersubjectivity #Lacan #love #misunderstanding #NorbertWiley #symbolicInteractionism
«Before blaming digital technology, we should perhaps consider the fact that its specific use is dictated and conditioned by the contemporary model of society in which the same technology is produced and used. Our western capitalist model speaks more of individuals than of groups, praises self-empowerment and competition at the expense of solidarity, leading people to an ever-growing anxious fight for self-promotion.»
#digital #mediascape #digitalnatives #embodiedsimulation #intersubjectivity #psychopathology
#neuroscience
https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/full/10.1080/09540261.2024.2355281
#introduction time... I'm an artist exploring perceptions of sound and space to find resonance between people and places through experimental sound, image and social practices.
exploring; #deeplistening, auditory agency, #animism, land-based narratives, micro sociologies, #intersubjectivity, #chaos and #complexity, #geomorphology, #weathering, #peripheries, rewilding, rural futures and more... #fieldrecording #eurorack #modular #maaheli #microsound
Live seminar and discussion on participatory sense-making taking place at the moment.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zrirQewE9Z8
This is part of the Core Enaction programme, which looks to have a wonderful line-up of conversations/events over the next few weeks.
📌 Every week, we highlight an #ebook or #ejournal from our collection. This week’s pick:
➡️ Journal of Spinoza Studies; Special issue: "Intersubjective Readings of Spinoza" and Debate on the 'Free Man'
🔗 https://jss.rug.nl/issue/view/5035
Journal of Spinoza Studies is an #OpenAccess journal published by University of Groningen Press.
#philosophy #Spinoza #Aristotle #identity #intersubjectivity
Please boost FREE community #fediscience!
LIVE and ZOOM, all welcome!
TONIGHT!!
Tues Jan 9, 6:30pm (London time) we start our Spring Term with #CamillaPower on
'Egalitarianism made us human. Why Graeber and Wengrow get it wrong'
LIVE
@UCLanthropology 2nd Floor Daryll Forde Seminar Room, 14 Taviton St. London WC1H 0BW
Everyone welcome to just turn up or join on ZOOM
Details
http://radicalanthropologygroup.org/blog/egalitarianism-made-us-human-why-graeber-and-wengrow-get-it-wrong/
#egalitarianism #huntergatherers #DawnofEverything #intersubjectivity #language #encephalization #collectivechildcare
‘The soundbite “trust the science” has been circulating recently. This framing is unfortunate. Because “the science” in this context is usually a snapshot of ideas or facts in a particular moment—and often from the perspective of a small number of people (or even one person).’
- H. HOLDEN THORP
https://www.science.org/content/blog-post/it-matters-who-does-science
The Fusion of Horizons
Husserl and community.
The focus of the present issue is on Husserl’s contribution to the field of social ontology. For many years, #Husserl has been regarded as a methodological solipsist with little to say on #intersubjectivity. Over the past thirty years, this interpretation has been solidly rejected by the majority of Husserl scholars. Within the last ten years, however, there has also been a growing appreciation of the fact that Husserl didn’t just investigate empathy and dyadic forms of social relations, but—like many of his contemporaries—also wrote extensively on the nature of community, i.e., on large scale social formations and groups (...)
Szanto, T., Meindl, P. & Zahavi, D. Introduction: Husserl and community. Cont Philos Rev (2023). https://doi.org/10.1007/s11007-023-09617-z
@mariapopova a nice reminder of #LeGuin and #intersubjectivity. I was inspired by her work and confident that intersubjectivity was a phenomenon that existed, that it was not just an epistemological description.
Now, more cynical, I wonder how it is possible for humans to communicate anything as they talk past each other and fail to engage. Something happened. 😳
I'd love some help finding communities here that chat about:
#poetry
#complexity science
#psychology
#literature
#tech for good
#writing
#community building
#evolution
#watercolour painting
#intersubjectivity
#social connection
#mental health
#games
#collaboration
#alternative education
#teaching
#mentorship
#intergeneration
Making it groove! Entrainment, participation and discrepancy in the'conversation'of a jazz trio
Focusing on a live performance by a jazz trio, this case study examines the wordless dialogical 'groove' between musicians. Building on ethnomusicological theories of interaction in conjunction with the notion of entrainment, the study makes use of in-depth temporal analysis of musical interaction alongside the reported phenomenal experiences of the participating musicians.
This approach provides an intriguing triangulation between subjective experience and 'hard' temporal data and thus moves to a consideration of musical meaning away from the formal properties of a work and towards the dynamic interactions of the players. While the study of pragmatics has undoubtedly been important in the refinement of scholarly research into music performance, this article suggests that a turn to 'groove' may be of use in broadening our conceptions of linguistic interchange.
https://doi.org/10.1179/175975309X452012
#ENTRAINMENT #interaction #intersubjectivity #JAZZ #participatory #discrepancies #Temporality #MUSIC #groove #groovy #jazz
• https://inquiryintoinquiry.com/2022/11/06/sign-relational-manifolds-5-2/
Let me try to say in intuitive terms what I think is really going on here.
The problem is as old as those about #OtherMinds, #Intersubjectivity, or #Commensurability and it involves a whole slew of other old problems — #RealityVsAppearance or #RealityVsRepresentation, not to mention #TheOneAndTheMany. One way to sum up the question might be “conditions on the possibility of a #MutuallyObjectiveWorld ”.
In our view,, the most important and influential book on human evolution this century is Sarah Hrdy's 'Mothers and Others' (2009, Harvard UP). Hrdy, a longstanding #Darwinian #feminist should be far better known than any of the Pinkers, Hararis, Wranghams et al. She is way more knowledgeable about what made us human.
The focus in 'Mothers and others' is on the evolution of our mutual-mindreading capacities -- which are really not there in other great apes. She roots this in babysitting -- human mothers hand over young infants to the care of diverse others. She argues the onset of such childcare practice would emerge early Pleistocene with H erectus. The outcome of ability to mesh emotional states preceded and was the foundation for #evolution of #language
#evolutionaryanthropology #cooperativechildcare #intersubjectivity
Image description: cover of Mothers and others with a baby being lifted high in a carer's arms (who may not be actual mother)
https://books.google.co.uk/books/about/Mothers_and_Others.html?id=dsiksDFQPDsC&printsec=frontcover&source=kp_read_button&hl=en&newbks=1&newbks_redir=0&gboemv=1&redir_esc=y#v=onepage&q&f=false
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